Designed to be used – An interview

Buildings designed to be used

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In the beginning of June, Christian and I went to Grundfos Facility, to ask the new Sr. Director of Group Facility Management some questions regarding how Grundfos handles Facility Services, in an ever-changing world.  

We had a great discussion about cooling systems, our work, the future of office buildings, why Grundfos Facility have chosen to insource work that was previously outsourced and how to align sustainability goals with real-life. We talked about the connecting of designs and operations of a cooling system and how that might affect the way we build and manage buildings.

To provide some background into why chose to sit down with Kjeld, Christian noted:  

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“Our goal is to improve the efficiency of Chilled Water Systems. In the process of doing so, there are the people who design and build the systems, and those that operate them, but the interaction between them is quite poor. Then comes the dilemma of many people not knowing just how much electricity is actually used on those systems so we set up some design criteria and started working on fixing these issues.  

In my experience, there is a tendency to find designing and building the systems more prestigious than operating it, but if you flip it, you can see that it's actually super important to understand how the system operates. For that reason, what we really want is to end this divide because the process could be much more seamless if those involved in the loop would have knowledge of both the design AND operation of the system.

I do think we’ve had some success through our panel discussion and webinars, and the way we communicate with our audience but then I saw that you [Kjeld] have transferred to facility and started insourcing and so I think it would be interesting to try to understand the reason you made such a choice.

Kjeld:  

Of course, it's still a bit fresh, but we expect to be able to do just as well. Because ISS is more like a temp agency, they have provided 25 men who do a piece of work, and then we still have to go in and check it. So now we need to start focusing even more on sustainability and reduce CO2 and water consumption, for which we need to have people who can do things themselves and make decisions themselves. So, it is simply to streamline the service we provide our users, and so that we, at the same time, can focus on the projects in the field of sustainability and digitization that we want.

Christian:  

What competencies and profiles do you need when you are insourcing and want to focus on more optimal and sustainable operations?

Kjeld:  

Well, most of the people are mechanics, electricians, or carpenters and so on. So, they are the same type of people, but since we can then streamline our operations, we can also get a project manager and people who focus on sustainability. Or perhaps someone, who has more of an engineering approach to it and can help us focus on what we need to work on, so, it's the optimal use of our supplies.  

We have some people that go around and visits these sites […] and see that they can easily be operated in a much more sustainable and optimal way. So, ensuring that we have the conditions to support all the companies that have their own equipment is something we want to achieve with this new organization. Within the facility, and in Grundfos. […] We have what we have. That is what we need to operate the best way.

Christian:  

How important is the facility or utilities, compared to that in Grundfos overall? Regarding the scope one, scope two and scope 3*?

Kjeld:  

Scope two. And that's where we're working hard to see what we can do or reduce. We are also part of the roadmap, which will form the basis for a science-based target, which has a big impact. There is a lot we can contribute, but the best, is probably to have an optimal operation of the equipment. Simply because those who run the equipment, don’t have enough skills to do it the right way, because typically it’s not the right facility people who run it and would not have the proper training.

• Source: What are Scopes 1, 2 and 3 of Carbon Emissions? - Plan A Academy

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Christian:

How about your own journey? How did you get to the conclusion that coming to facility would be the best?

Kjeld:  

Yeah, that's kind of funny. Well, I really wanted to get closer to some of those bigger decisions, because AME (Advanced Manufacturing Engineering – The Development for more effective production within Grundfos,) is super good work, but it's so confined to a single area. So, I wanted to be a little more among the people and be able to contribute to how someone like you feels in your workplace.

Kjeld:  

[…] I believe that in a few years we will look back at this time, discussing; How do we work together? Why do people come to work? And what does it take? Because many, in Denmark at least, and many other Western European countries, would rather sit at home today. So why is it that they must go back to the office?

And a lot of that is HR talk. But we have talked about rooms and the buildings. Because when you are maybe back at work 3 or 2 days a week, you should not go into an office and close the door, and then sit there. So, the buildings need to be ready for it, with offices becoming collaboration or meeting rooms, and whatever else you can come up with. Making facility one of the big players in the workspace of the future.

Christian:

What have you done yourself, here at facility?

Kjeld:  

Well, facility is one of the places that was first converted into future offices, where there are several small Skype rooms, as they called it. Sofas that are all around so you can sit down and not disturb.  

Christian:  

But could you focus in on the people who design facilities, and those who operate them. Because you say it's significant that with operation […] collaboration is not great.

How do you think we can make operations and design work better together?

Kjeld:  

Well, they are in the same house. It's the same function. So, I do not see it being that difficult, because some of the project managers who are building the new factories today know that they will have to run it afterwards or come from the operation side of it. So there, I think we have a good working relationship.

For us there is the collaboration between who designs the building and who has to use the building afterwards because the people we have to help design, are trained as users of the buildings, more or less themselves.

The problem for us is that the buildings we are building today must also be here in 50 years. Or 30 years. And a good example is both East 2 and East 3. These were fantastic buildings, 30 years ago. But are they today?  

[…]

Who built East 3, is sitting right here in facility. He is still here. And he did not wake up, 30 years ago, and say, "Now I have to bother all the people.", Right?

And that is not what we are doing today. But what will it look like in 30 years? Or how can we build in such a way that it will be easier to switch around, now that we know that the trend is changing faster.

Because if we had talked three years ago, well then, we would probably have said that there should 100 percent be desks for everyone, and they should stand like this and like that but now you don't really do that. So just the last three years we have completely turned our backs on how we think about buildings. What should be inside buildings and how we will use them. Because now we are talking about working from the office, from home, from the hub, from anywhere.

Andrea:

It was also interesting to think about trying to design buildings with the purpose of them being flexible enough to keep up. Because I think when we've talked about buildings before, just me who doesn’t know anything about it, though, 'Okay, we'll have this, […] this is what we've always had. " So how can we just move on?

You are aiming for a building to be designed to be used. Not to be built a certain way because that is how it’s been done for the last 50 years. It's amazing to see the shift in culture.

Kjeld:

Yes, the major architectural firms, also say that today. After all, they have hired futurists in their staff to really think scientifically about what we need to do in the future […] and now they have also started to follow up on what the users think about the building.

[…]

And also, because one has streamlined so much that 20 years ago, we could afford for a man to stand there and look after it [the cooling system].

So, the person is taking care of the whole plant and it will be him who has to adjust and has an HVAC education from Denmark. But if he was from Hungary, or Serbia, or Turkey, or possibly anywhere further he would not have it. There they do not have the professional education that we do.

So that's why it's something you really should think about. It must be included in the calculation that you have some people who do not have an education like do have in Denmark, who must then try to run it [the cooling system]. So, it creates demands on the design of the building and the design of the equipment.

Christian:  

Yes. But that is also what we see going wrong. That it’s put into operation, and then there is someone who goes there as a technician. Because there must be someone standing by, but they do not really know what to turn on or what is happening.

[…]

Inside the building has changed a lot too. And then there is some utility around it, which kind of supplies the building. Just like we have a heating plant out here and there is a refrigeration plant down in Singapore.

How do you see the split, or interplay, of it? How is it developing now that the use of buildings has to change so much?

Kjeld:  

I think it’s more about the actual building operations as well. For example, now that we are discussing China, the new factory we are going to build out there, we would like to send some of the hot water down into the ground, and then bring it up in the winter. We do that here in Denmark with a central heating. And I think there will be more of that in the future and then we get a much greater collaboration with local authorities.

But also, that we do it because electricity is not just electricity that comes when we press a button, but we have to go out and work to get electricity. To get heating, we will have to think creatively in the future, to get the most sustainable solutions.

Christian:  

And it sounds a bit like it's an independent process to make sure that the heating and cooling supply works.

Kjeld:  

Yes. And also, that we train ourselves for it in the future. Because the development is going so fast that we cannot keep up. From next week we also have a new feature called sustainability, which should help us look at how we continue to be sustainable going forward.

[…]

That is also why you can understand really well that it is both water and CO2 we have to look at here in Grundfos.

[…]

Andrea:  

I just have some loose ends. If you could choose something that makes you think now, I'm successful, what would it be?

Kjeld:  

Well, it will definitely be the sustainability journey we are going on within the building and the future offices.

[…]

Andrea:  

Are there any things you can take with you from your past positions?

Kjeld:  

Yes, I think it is important to have a clear project model, just like the DP model there. Now we decide and move on.

Christian:  

Yes, but how is it the same when doing product development and setting up factories, and how is it different when it's a facility?

Kjeld:  

Well, it is different in the content. Because there is something about how we get ideas for it, and how we then go out and ask some advisers to help us, we also have to decide and […]

there are different gates in it, but the principle of having these gates is really good.

Christian:  

But it's still wild that now that you're sitting and making such a model yourself, when we have big companies like ISS inside running the facility.

[…]

Andrea:

So, you are trying to convey why it's so important to do it properly - not just patchwork solutions.

Kjeld:

Yes.

Andrea:  

I think I have understood over time that there are quite a few who do not quite agree on why it is so important. I don´t have any more questions for now, thank you for your time, this have been very interesting.  

Kjeld: You are welcome.

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